I'm swearing off of the Liberty Launcher

[Techercizer]

As fun as it was to use, I hate op crutch weapons, and I hate what Valve's doing to this game. It's time for me to learn how to lead my rockets like everyone else.

From now on I'll probably be using vanilla. Maybe a BB if my team is incompetent.

[Saber]

Good. I fucking hate the Liberty Launcher. Mostly because random crits. "OH YOU'RE AT FULL HEALTH DIRECT HIT SPEED ROCKET COMING AT YOUR FACE SEE YOU IN 20 SECONDS"
GOD.

[Spyder]

Mostly because random crits.

[Saber]

Mostly because random crits.

Yes I am serious.
Problem?

[Amplify]

"OH YOU'RE AT FULL HEALTH DIRECT HIT SPEED ROCKET COMING AT Y--"

Fixed.

[Saber]

The fucking thing is rage-inducing. I don't use it because I prefer firepower.

[Phantom]

Vanilla is the way to go IMO
4 rockets is uber good

[duck]

Maybe a BB if my team is incompetent.

yes! now you know how i feel

[Techercizer]

Maybe a BB if my team is incompetent.

yes! now you know how i feel

Just don't use it when I'm Medic and we'll be squishy smooth.

[duck]

Maybe a BB if my team is incompetent.

yes! now you know how i feel

Just don't use it when I'm Medic and we'll be squishy smooth.

well i have 1100 kills with my new rl that odin gave me, and i have 4500 kills with the blackbox. so im content using anything regardless if i have a medic or not

[mrpikmin2]

yes! now you know how i feel

Just don't use it when I'm Medic and we'll be squishy smooth.

well i have 1100 kills with my new rl that odin gave me, and i have 4500 kills with the blackbox. so im content using anything regardless if i have a medic or not

I'm calling placebo effect, or maybe the fact you run out of rockets loaded faster causes you to retreat more often, which causes typically a higher kill count. Or maybe you are just truly better with it, but I'm doubtful.

Anyway, I really love the quake rocket launcher over the default, as the aiming is much easier for me and the sounds are nice. Playing w/viewmodels off for those who care.

[Techercizer]

Also I'm changing hats, to symbolize my rejection of the Liberty Launcher.

[LegendarySurgeon]

well i have 1100 kills with my new rl that odin gave me, and i have 4500 kills with the blackbox. so im content using anything regardless if i have a medic or not

I'm calling placebo effect, or maybe the fact you run out of rockets loaded faster causes you to retreat more often, which causes typically a higher kill count. Or maybe you are just truly better with it, but I'm doubtful.

Anyway, I really love the quake rocket launcher over the default, as the aiming is much easier for me and the sounds are nice. Playing w/viewmodels off for those who care.

I think Duck's point was that the numbers were high; not that the BB's was higher; after all he did say the RL he got was "new"

[Techercizer]

Also changed my sig to commemorate my new anti-crutch playstyle. Have I missed a weapon? Post here and let me know.

[BoB Dolen]

Also changed my sig to commemorate my new anti-crutch playstyle. Have I missed a weapon? Post here and let me know.

Not really sure how 3 of them made that list....while a 4th yea I guess default counts

[Saber]

Pretentioussssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

[Chocolate Love God]

You forgot the DeadRinger and the Machina.

[Techercizer]

You forgot the DeadRinger and the Machina.

Have you seen any of my videos? I use the DR the way it was meant to be used, and I'm not going to give up the wide variety of skill-based playstyles it offers.

Machina... probably. I'll ruminate on it for a bit and get back to you.

[duck]

@ pikmin, because im to lazy to quote. i use the bb because 1. i like being alive and i dont like to be to aggresive. 2. i can aim, i only need three shots to kill someone 3. i rely on my shotgun a lot (i have about 1500 kills on it)

am i better with the bb, i have no clue.

[Wakka]

stickybomb launcher

default weapons?????

[Techercizer]

stickybomb launcher

default weapons?????

Yes??????

[Saber]

PRETENTIOUSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
I don't actually use the Tomislav mostly because I named my minigun.
Before stranges came out.
I still don't see how QF is OP, though.
Still going to use whatever weapons I want though.

[Techercizer]

PRETENTIOUSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
I don't actually use the Tomislav mostly because I named my minigun.
Before stranges came out.
I still don't see how QF is OP, though.
Still going to use whatever weapons I want though.

I never said the QF was OP. I said I wasn't going to use it, and that I appreciated those who felt the same.

[AuronV3]

WOOO SIGNING IN BLOOD. Let's begin being an asshole...

Soda Popper - It can be admittedly overpowered at times, namely due to the fact that you have to "save" your crits until you run into someone at point blank range, until then however you're pretty much stuck using your pistol should you be shooting someone at the range that it isn't effective. Not saying it isn't OP, but it does have some very shitty balance mechanics.

Liberty Launcher - I was originally going to make no post here, but I guess I'll put my 2 (scrap) in on the matter. 3 rockets is good enough when the rockets fly at INSANE speeds, but nevertheless, if one misses your almost never going to get the kill, and generally if your using LL, you can't aim too well with shotgun, bar anyone on here that is going to reply to this and say I'm wrong.

Axtinguisher; Phlogistinator (In white) - I can't speak of the Phlogistinator as I have not used it, but the Axtinguisher is pretty much the "Stock" weapon for pyro now, (Valve notices this stuff when they make a weapon the EXACT SAME with boosts) but that's not really an argument to make. It's just good enough to be the best pyro melee, but what is it competing against? Volcano Fragment? lul

Stickybomb Launcher - God forbid you craft all your demo secondaries... Oh sorry, you should actually put here "Sticky SPAMMING" as that is the biggest problem with this, not the weapon itself. The weapon was "Designed" to be a trap placing mechanic, that just failed massively, and they acknowledged this with the making of the Scottish resistance. Still, if you don't use the stickybomb launcher, your either making a huge handicap for yourself, or your using Demoknight, which you could argue in your terms is OP as well.

Tomislav - Hey it's dumbly good, but it just isn't as good as the minigun in the hands of the right person. Tomislav is just good for most scenarios, bar sniping on 2fort (It's practically the jack-of-all-trades minigun) where-as the minigun is good for mostly, well mid to close range, in which if you're decent, or the enemy sucks, you're going to dominate most of the enemy team.

Pomson 6000 (In white) - Copy pasta Phogistinator. NEXT

Quick Fix - What? Why is this OP, let alone a weapon that you just won't use. Is it because they heal quicker than medigun, therefore it's better? Or did I miss some mysterious update that makes the player invincible when you're using it? The medigun has the purpose of INVINCIBILITY when you uber, versus the "Psudo-invinciblity" with the quick-fix. It's easily stopped, and you shouldn't really have problems with it.

Bushwacka; Machina - OK, bushwacka I understand, almost no draw back, (Any "No Critical Hits/Fire damage" ones aren't really a drawback) but the Machina... Well... I uh, think its uh... ok, yes it's better than all the snipers, i think it deserves the good nerf, YOU WIN TECH, you win this round.

Enforcer; Spycicle (In white) - Enforcer is OP with Dead Ringer almost specifically, try using it with other watches and unless you can avoid everyone, you're pretty much guaranteed to die when a half focused person runs into you. Spycicle is again decent, and does deserve a Nerf, but the thing is kinda obvious. Yes, there are plenty of fixes (Best I've seen is pyros can thaw you out before a certain period of time) but until then, it's valves game, and you guys will still play it until they shut down servers.

In fact, for all these weapons, you can hate and whine and cry, but you won't really do anything, you'll still play the game (the way it was meant to be played, not sitting in a trade server for 5 ho... wait...) A single persons movement doesn't really make others think the same way, and yes, half these weapons up there are amazing, but they have some flaws to make them balanced in some situations. I argued alot that they are not really overpowered, when in reality probably all of them are, IN SOME SITUATIONS. Just because that situation comes up a lot does not make it overpowered, it's just simply the best in the class, and even when you do Nerf something, something else will just become more "overpowered", that's just shooters for you. If all weapons were balanced the game just wouldn't be fun.

...Then again all this is coming from a TRADE ADMIN.

TL;DR (You should probably just read this) - I become a complete jerk of the interwebs and probably lose respect in everyone's eyes. I'M SORRY EVERYONE, ESPECIALLY TECH.

[Techercizer]

Well I don't feel right using those weapons. I'm not trying to change TF2 or anything; I just believe in giving my opponents (and allies) a fair chance by my own definition.

[xbawkzes]

This thread has inspired me to now play TF2 using underpowered weapons.

I will use ONLY the following ALL the time:

Fan of War
Already-exploded Caber
Axtinguisher (without the use or help of fire)
The Jag

And that's all I can think of.
I will also use the Eternal Reward in conjunction with NOT using any spy watches and WITHOUT trying to backstab.

UNDERPOWER ACTIVATE.

[Trauma Advocate]

No offense Tech, but this topic does whiff of pretentiousness.

Guns like the Liberty Launcher, the Tomislav, and the Spycicle - They aren't overpowered. They're just easy mode.

When you get right down to it, the liberty launcher excels at duels and fails at brawls.
The tomislav lets you rape noobs while the minigun lets you win matches.
The Spycicle claims stealth while leaving a massive, bright white trail of destruction.

It kinda irks me when people abuse these weapons - using them exclusively, or in conjunction with horrible easy-mode combinations such as the Dr. Enforcicle set, but it really shouldn't... When one does it admits that you're either not such a good player or you're just playing to have fun.

I'm sure most of you have seen me with the liberty launcher in hand, but many of you may have also seen me using the mantreads, so if anyone takes issue, I intend to sit back and laugh.

[Techercizer]

Is it really pretentious to say that I don't feel right using these weapons myself, but respect others' wishes to use whatever weapon choices they believe in? If so, I guess it's a pretentious thread. Either way, I feel it was worth making.

[medkitz]

i play stinger pyro with axtinguisher, but i prefer using a Flare gun over it. does that make me a noob?

[Techercizer]

i play stinger pyro with axtinguisher, but i prefer using a Flare gun over it. does that make me a noob?

It makes you someone who plays with the axtinguisher and flare gun. What that means to you is something only you can decide.

[xbawkzes]

i play stinger pyro with axtinguisher, but i prefer using a Flare gun over it. does that make me a noob?

It makes you someone who plays with the axtinguisher and flare gun. What that means to you is something only you can decide.

It's a powerful push style of play, especially on maps with little or no water. I'm exactly the same. Degreaser, Flare, Axtinguisher. The rad way to destroy assholes.

[keeganzero]

Doesn't the saying go, "It's not the tool, it's how you use it?".
I know that normally is about something else, but can't it be related to TF2 weapons?
Most people use the "Easy Mode" weapons because they can't use the vanilla weapons and such.
If you are truly talented with your "tool", any weapon perks are irreverent.

[Techercizer]

Doesn't the saying go, "It's not the tool, it's how you use it?".
I know that normally is about something else, but can't it be related to TF2 weapons?
Most people use the "Easy Mode" weapons because they can't use the vanilla weapons and such.
If you are truly talented with your "tool", any weapon perks are irreverent.

I'm not a talented Soldier, though. I've spent so long with the LL that I've forgotten a lot of my rocket-leading skills.

[duck]

I'm not a talented Soldier, though. I've spent so long with the LL that I've forgotten a lot of my rocket-leading skills.

heres a few tips from a soldier main
1. aim at the ground
2. lead your rockets, try and predict were your opponent is trying to go
3. dont just rely on your rl, your shotgun is just as useful if you can aim.
4. learn to rocket jump, it can be usefull in offensive and defensive situations

[keeganzero]

I'm not a talented Soldier, though. I've spent so long with the LL that I've forgotten a lot of my rocket-leading skills.

heres a few tips from a soldier main
1. aim at the ground
2. lead your rockets, try and predict were your opponent is trying to go
3. dont just rely on your rl, your shotgun is just as useful if you can aim.
4. learn to rocket jump, it can be usefull in offensive and defensive situations

Solider in a nut shell right here

[duck]

I'm not a talented Soldier, though. I've spent so long with the LL that I've forgotten a lot of my rocket-leading skills.

heres a few tips from a soldier main
1. aim at the ground
2. lead your rockets, try and predict were your opponent is trying to go
3. dont just rely on your rl, your shotgun is just as useful if you can aim.
4. learn to rocket jump, it can be usefull in offensive and defensive situations

Solider in a nut shell right here

thanks!

[Wakka]

try to shoot rockets at the enemies such that they take more damage than they have health

[keeganzero]

When you say it like that you make the solider sound like a pyro

[Necro Wes]

5. Try to stand still and shoot rockets at a pyro who has a clear line of sight to the rest of you team.

[Wakka]

i play every class like pyro

well, except for pyro, i just shotgun

[keeganzero]

Please explain to me how you play spy as pyro

[Fence!]

I'm not a talented Soldier, though. I've spent so long with the LL that I've forgotten a lot of my rocket-leading skills.

heres a few tips from a soldier main
1. aim at the ground
2. lead your rockets, try and predict were your opponent is trying to go
3. dont just rely on your rl, your shotgun is just as useful if you can aim.
4. learn to rocket jump, it can be usefull in offensive and defensive situations

4. learn to rocket jump, it can be useful in offensive and defensive situations

jumpit has some nice servers up and the people there are pretty helpful at teaching jumpz. Nef and Herk taught me how to do dem jumps (granted I still suck) and it helped tremendously.

Edit: also machina isn't OP... sydney sleeper set is OP/not worth using unless you like making me rage.

[Techercizer]

jumpit has some nice servers up and the people there are pretty helpful at teaching jumpz. Nef and Herk taught me how to do dem jumps (granted I still suck) and it helped tremendously.

Edit: also machina isn't OP... sydney sleeper set is OP/not worth using unless you like making me rage.

I haven't forgotten how to jump or how to play Soldier. I've just lost my familiarity with leading slow-moving rockets on far away targets.

I don't really like using the Machina because of how powerful it is when fully-charged; If I'm going for headshots, I'd rather stick with stock.

[jawsh]

I'm swearing on the stickylauncher.
sup?

[Fence!]

slow-moving rockets on far away targets

Yeah, far away is the key word here because most of the time you're running right at someone and if they're far enough away, they'll just dodge the rocket or slow down once you've shot.

I think someone (Jawsh) mentioned MGE? I'd say that's probably da best

[Rologton]

I've finally read the topic, Tech!

I'm one of those Scout mains that turns their nose at any primary other than the Vanilla Scattergun. I'll take the versatility and staying power in a sustained battle of the Scattergun any day, so fuck the Popper.

I don't think it's OP, but the LL is deffinately a crutch. It's one of those weapons that new Soldiers can start using and think that they are good. Also, that 4th rocket can be really important.

I use the Gas Jockey set with the Pyro anyway, but I've never had much a problem with the Axtinguisher. Melee is pretty redundant in this game anyway, especially for guys like Pyro and Scout whos primaries do way more damage in the same range. There's no point in VALVe trying to ballance the Stock melees by this point as the weapons that offer utility, like the Axtinguisher, Equalizer and Atomizer to a redundant weapon slot will always be preferable. As for the Phlogistinator: Fuck that thing. There's literally no skill involved in W+M1, and that's all you can do with this thing. Because of Compression Blast, the Pyro has the highest skill ceiling of any class in the game. That thing is HARD to master. Without it he's just "herpa-derp, imma run at-chew". Which, admittedly and unfortunately, is what he is to a good chunck of shitty players anyway.

I don't know why you'd swear off the Sticky Launcher. Ok, yeah, it's spammable, but it's also the strongest weapon in the game. No, seriously, ask any comp-level player, and they'll tell you just that. There's a reason you're only allowed 1 Demoman in Comp, and a reason every team always runs him. The SL makes him super mobile and allows for rediculous damage output.

Good, the Tomislav is an aweful weapon. It completely removes one of the Heavys core weaknesses, ambushes, for no downside. It has the third highest DPS in the game. The only weapons higher? Stock Minigun/Natascha at #2, and the Brass Beast at #1, and those weapons he can at least be ambushed with. It can do everything the Stock minigun can do except for destroy a Sentry that an Engie is repairing, and otherwise is better in most situations because of the fast spin-up. It makes the once true idea of Scout being Heavy's soft-counter laughable.

Fuck the Pomson. Uber Drain is a retarded mechanic and should never have been implemented. Add on the fact that this weapon is stupidly spammable with no draw back, can't be defended against by using your patient as cover, and that its most dangerous mechanic (the Uber Drain) doesn't suffer from falloff. I hope to see this weapon as little as possible.

Honestly, the QF is laughably under powered. As a Scout/Medic main, I can tell you that there is no reason to use it over the Medigun and Kritzkreig. It's not even the lack of overheal. I'm alright with that. It's the fact that the speed boost works only on Scouts and that the Uber is embarasingly weak that makes this a bad weapon. If the speed boost worked on Gas Jockey Pyros and Eyelander Demos with extra heads, and there was a stronger Uber, then it would be a sidegrade. Otherwise, the only time this weapon is useful is if you're the second Medic on the team, so you quickly max out your Teammates and send them to your other Medic for Overheal, but in the end, that's detrimental as it effectively steals Uber from your teammate using a better Medigun.

Bushwacka I don't mind. Like I said before, by this point there's no point in using most Vanilla melees as they're redundant. Machina I can see, but I'm still not convinced it's OP. The tracers are purely cosmetic, and it only pierces on a fully charged shot, where as most good Snipers don't sit and wait before taking a shot anyway. And I actually consider the lack of no-scopes to be a legitimate downside. A close range no-scope can really save your life.

Finally, fuuuuuuuuuuuuuck the Enforcer. I hate that thing. It has no downsides with the DR, and it's barely noticeable with the other watches. It can 2-shot half of the classes in the game, making backstabs redundant half the time. Why get close for a backstab and risk your life when you can shoot someone from a safe distance for the same effect? It give the Spy way more hitting power than he really needs, the Revolver is already a very powerful weapon. What I think it needs? I think its downside should be that you can't activate cloak with it out. Then, more than anything, we'd no longer see the DR/Enforcer playstyle. As for the Spycicle, it's deffinately a strong weapon. I'm still not sure where I stand on this thing, to be honest. In one hand, I don't see it wrecking up the place like the Enforcer, yet on the other hand it deffinately feels like an upgrade over the Vanilla Knife, especially against teams without Pyros. Except for players like the legendary stabby stabby who laugh at Pyros chasing them down in the form of a well timed corner stab, it's deffinately an upgrade.

So yeah, those are my thoughts. Sorry for the long windedness of it.