New Rocket Launcher is WAAAAY over powered

[Failhorse]

Finger can attest to my slaughter yesterday.
RL + Medic = even me good.

[Mad Anthony]

Video Or It Didn't Happen

[Techercizer]

I concur; LL is EZmode aiming for Soldiers, AND it teaches you how to manage your ammo in a way I never really learned to with the RL.

[Mad Anthony]

over powered how?

[stanley]

over powered how?

theres pretty much no prediction involved when aiming, the opponent has no time to react, its just easy to use in general IMO

[Techercizer]

over powered how?

theres pretty much no prediction involved when aiming, the opponent has no time to react, its just easy to use in general IMO

^All at the same reload speed, making your only downside a smaller burst capacity.

Smaller burst capacity actually encourages you to retreat, reload, and regroup more often, keeping you alive far better than your generic "hold m1 until rockets are out" suicide-Soldier.

[Omega]

Sigh... LL is DH with RL's AOE >.>. It shoots fast enough to Kill Heavys assuming u have cover. The 3 clip doesnt matter as much in 1 vs 1 as its 2-3 Rockets for all classes ,cept Heavy, assume non overhealed. And even then the gained time from travel distance accounts for the lack of clip. Generally, at medium range, it takes the same time to shoot 4 (1 reload) from the LL as it takes to shoot 4 from the RL, the only advantage of the RL is that its better for shorter range crowd controls. Also, the increased speed in shorter ranges allows almost no reaction (strafe) time in mid air for the victim. Its the new natasha (bit less op) as it takes a lot less skill to use, and is only worse compared to the RL if the RL is used skillful (and only in a handful of scenarios). Neither the less, if u cant aim for S***, the RL > LL for Soldier vs Soldier. However, if u cant aim, u shouldnt rly be playing unless ur just practising. The LL's a crutch, sadly to say, but the LL is too veratile for its own good. Its the goddamn Natasha scenario all over again (Minigun > Natasha mostly only in Heavy vs Heavy scenarios). I wont be surprised if the next weapon balence on TF2 Beta is the LL -_-.

[Echoplex]

Black box is for noobs, Liberty Launcher is for noobs

[Techercizer]

Black box is for noobs, Liberty Launcher is for noobs

- BB is for people who don't trust their medic, don't think they'll find many health kits, or will otherwise have trouble staying alive.

- LL is for people who don't anticipate needing a high burst output, don't like leading targets, or otherwise prefer rapid damage over high output.

The 1st isn't as useful once you learn when to disengage and go find a Medic. The second is still good even if you know how to lead your targets, since it makes long-ranged combat more viable and allows you to put more damage into unsuspecting opponents before they realize what's going on.

[stanley]

Black box is for noobs, Liberty Launcher is for noobs

second part is true, which is why i dont use it even though i play well with it. but i still <3 the black box

[Hatred]

Black box is for noobs, Liberty Launcher is for noobs

yep before all these stupid new wepaons came out soldier was already way OP ... high HP, High damage, splash damage, and no aim required unless you air shot ...

[Toaster]

Black box is for noobs, Liberty Launcher is for noobs

yep before all these stupid new wepaons came out soldier was already way OP ... high HP, High damage, splash damage, and no aim required unless you air shot ...

Don't forget, he also has 2 primary weapons and equalizer is by far the best melee weapon (arguably fists of steel are but in a different sense).

[Omega]

BB is for pubs like 90% unless u know ur team. LL is just sad, its an AID for ppl who want DPS rather consistent AOE.

[Omega]

BB is for pubs like 90% unless u know ur team. LL is just sad, its an AID for ppl who want DPS rather consistent AOE.

[VoltySquirrel]

I like the Liberty Launcher... ):

[SovietPanda]

I like the Liberty Launcher... ):

[Techercizer]

Fuck AOE; I'm not a demoman.

DPS ftw.

[Omega]

No point in changing ur mind, i mean it IS Solo Fortress 2 >.>
Still LL lacks in team protecting capabilities

[Techercizer]

No point in changing ur mind, i mean it IS Solo Fortress 2 >.>
Still LL lacks in team protecting capabilities

I protect my team with the LL by killing anyone dumb enough to mess with them. All the extra damage I do lets me pop buff banners like some sort of poster merc for flag-based ADHD, which lets my teammates dish out more than enough hurt to cover an extra spam-rocket or two that I didn't launch.

[Echoplex]

The real rocket launcher is the best; rocket launcher.

[GoDM1N]

over powered how?

theres pretty much no prediction involved when aiming, the opponent has no time to react, its just easy to use in general IMO

^All at the same reload speed, making your only downside a smaller burst capacity.

Smaller burst capacity actually encourages you to retreat, reload, and regroup more often, keeping you alive far better than your generic "hold m1 until rockets are out" suicide-Soldier.

So what would a Solly that applies this with the normal rocket be? God?



Anyway, its not OP and heres why. The LL aids lesser sollies (like me) aim their rockets, however they aren't as capable of doing as much as a actual good solly with the normal rockets due to the lack of the 4th rocket. This is the reason a lot of people think the LL is OP, because sucky sollies who cant aim their normal rockets can now actually hit things. That said, if a good Solly who rarely misses like Snowsickle were to use the LL, he would be handicapping himself because now he only has 3 in the tube vs 4. So like Big Bear said, the LL is for noobs... like me :3

[Mongoose]

Lets just all agree the DH is the best.

[VoltySquirrel]

Lets just all agree the DH is the best.

Nope.avi

[GoDM1N]

Nope.avi

[Toaster]

big ass post

LL is great because classes can's dodge the projectile from short/medium range with out some luck. I wouldn't say anyone can safely assume that they'll direct their 4 rockets and do 400 damage between every reload cycle. LL offers consistency, the fact that you'll land more directs and average a higher damage out put indefinitely with more ease is what makes it op. Also my other points, not being able to dodge stuff like LnL and DH is pretty bs when at close range those weapons are hit scan 1 shot kills on 1/3 of the classes in tf2.

[GoDM1N]

big ass post

LL is great because classes can's dodge the projectile from short/medium range with out some luck. I wouldn't say anyone can safely assume that they'll direct their 4 rockets and do 400 damage between every reload cycle. LL offers consistency, the fact that you'll land more directs and average a higher damage out put indefinitely with more ease is what makes it op. Also my other points, not being able to dodge stuff like LnL and DH is pretty bs when at close range those weapons are hit scan 1 shot kills on 1/3 of the classes in tf2.

Then dont charge one head on :3

Also sure it offers consistency but its still limited and good sollys handicap themselves by using it.

[Techercizer]

Then dont charge one head on :3
Also sure it offers consistency but its still limited and good sollys handicap themselves by using it.

Some of us WANT to charge head on. It's called a side-grade; it makes you better in an area you didn't excel in while handicapping you in the area you did, allowing you to remain just as powerful overall but with that power used in different tactics and playstyles.

Giving a RL soldier a LL is like giving an Axtinguisher Pyro a BB, or like giving a DR spy the invis watch. The weapons do different things, and the skill sets don't necessarily transfer over. You can be a good LL soldier, and you can be a good RL soldier, but the two play differently, are effective in different situations, and don't transfer all skill gained as one type to the other.

Saying the LL is for noobs is like saying the BB is for noobs. It might be easily used by noobs, but there are times you don't need airblast to do your job, and you'd be much more effective with the BB.

[GoDM1N]

Then dont charge one head on :3
Also sure it offers consistency but its still limited and good sollys handicap themselves by using it.

Some of us WANT to charge head on. It's called a side-grade; it makes you better in an area you didn't excel in while handicapping you in the area you did, allowing you to remain just as powerful overall but with that power used in different tactics and playstyles.

Giving a RL soldier a LL is like giving an Axtinguisher Pyro a BB, or like giving a DR spy the invis watch. The weapons do different things, and the skill sets don't necessarily transfer over. You can be a good LL soldier, and you can be a good RL soldier, but the two play differently, are effective in different situations, and don't transfer all skill gained as one type to the other.

Saying the LL is for noobs is like saying the BB is for noobs. It might be easily used by noobs, but there are times you don't need airblast to do your job, and you'd be much more effective with the BB.

So the LL isn't OP /thread

Also my point was it helps noobs aim rockets better, which it does :3

[stanley]

good sollys handicap themselves by using it.

sorry for posting again, but dbz#ss was using it the other day and wrecking the server with it, he had 260 ish points in one map, hes a good solly, but he wasnt handicapping himself, he tripled the 3rd highest scorer on the team in points (2nd highest was med)

[GoDM1N]

good sollys handicap themselves by using it.

sorry for posting again, but dbz#ss was using it the other day and wrecking the server with it, he had 260 ish points in one map, hes a good solly, but he wasnt handicapping himself, he tripled the 3rd highest scorer on the team in points (2nd highest was med)

They do that as pyros as well, or snipers. Aren't they actual pro players?

[stanley]

good sollys handicap themselves by using it.

sorry for posting again, but dbz#ss was using it the other day and wrecking the server with it, he had 260 ish points in one map, hes a good solly, but he wasnt handicapping himself, he tripled the 3rd highest scorer on the team in points (2nd highest was med)

They do that as pyros as well, or snipers. Aren't they actual pro players?

yah, they are pro players, and he was using the LL, thats my point. you were saying good soldiers handicap themselves by using it, but he certainly wasnt

[Mike808]

hard ass' top solly used it yesterday and did the same thing. it doesnt matter when you are that good. z would have done exactly the same
they either direct hit us or hit us so close the splash does max damage so the 1 less rocket isnt much to them
and they are beast at aiming the shotgun

[Sirnak]

hard ass' top solly used it yesterday and did the same thing. it doesnt matter when you are that good. z would have done exactly the same
they either direct hit us or hit us so close the splash does max damage so the 1 less rocket isnt much to them
and they are beast at aiming the shotgun

Actually, competition-level soldiers are the ones I find the easiest to kill as Pyro (if they don't change for the shotgun at least). Since they shoot perfectly with their rocket, it's much much easier to time airblasts.

The new rocket launcher is something else for me though. Since my old computer screen has a retarded MS, I actually don't even see the rockets fired by the new rocket launcher before it explodes on me. Too fast for my screen, much like the Direct Hit. I'm gonna buy a new computer screen soon though. I'll finally be able to try countering this annoying new rocket launcher.

[GoDM1N]

yah, they are pro players, and he was using the LL, thats my point. you were saying good soldiers handicap themselves by using it, but he certainly wasnt

He was handicapped, he most likely could of done better with the normal RL. "Good players get lots of points" doesn't mean something is OP especially with all the F2P accounts now. Yesterday I got 76 points in one round with the Loch n load, is that OP? That 4th rocket is their jump to safety, or a 2nd/3rd kill and they don't have it with the LL or BB

[stanley]

yah, they are pro players, and he was using the LL, thats my point. you were saying good soldiers handicap themselves by using it, but he certainly wasnt

He was handicapped, he most likely could of done better with the normal RL. "Good players get lots of points" doesn't mean something is OP. That 4th rocket is their jump to safety, or a 2nd/3rd kill and they don't have it with the LL or BB

then why would he waste his time with the LL...

[GoDM1N]

yah, they are pro players, and he was using the LL, thats my point. you were saying good soldiers handicap themselves by using it, but he certainly wasnt

He was handicapped, he most likely could of done better with the normal RL. "Good players get lots of points" doesn't mean something is OP. That 4th rocket is their jump to safety, or a 2nd/3rd kill and they don't have it with the LL or BB

then why would he waste his time with the LL...

Why do I waste my time with the Loch N load, the Huntsman, Reserve Shooter, Disciplinary Action or any of the other gimmick weapons? They're new weapons that are fun to use and offer a different play style. Everyone tries out the new weapons, even pro players.

[stanley]

Why do I waste my time with the Loch N load, the Huntsman, Reserve Shooter, Disciplinary Action or any of the other gimmick weapons? They're new weapons that are fun to use and offer a different play style. Everyone tries out the new weapons, even pro players.

first off i wouldnt call any of the weapons you just named gimmick weapons, and second, i guess i just disagree about the LL

[Omega]

If u guyz actually read what I wrote, I wrote that the reason y LL is considered op is because of Med/SHort Distance encounters. At Med Dis, it takes aprox the same time to land 4 hits with the RL, then to land 3, reload, and land the 4th with an LL. 8/9 classes take less than 3 shots per kill. Plus the increased travel speed of each rocket allows little to none warning/ dodge time (strafe time in the air). Short Dis is the same problem. The increase on the DH is not op due to its fail AoE. However, walking in and out of an enclosed room shooting the center of the room with the LL guarantees a pop, which the solly can rapidly shoot the victim before the victim even lands. The LL is also good for taking heavys as the increase of the rocket speed makes the rocket significantly harder to dodge. And I agree with volt, the two playstyles are completely different. RL and LL are opposites. RL uses its 4 rocket for short distance AoE crowd control while LL's playstyle is more distance "sniping". However, the reason LL is considered more "op" is due to its easy use as LL can be used in short distances, against all but heavys (all classes assuming non healed) and the RL lacks dmg/precision when used for longer distances. The BB is contains a style of both. Attacking/retreat due to the 3 ammo clip size, long range hit and run for healing purposes in arena, and short/short-medium range dps/popping purposes. Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

[GoDM1N]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

[Techercizer]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

Just ask the MONGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSE...!

*shakes fist at sky*

[GoDM1N]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

Just ask the MONGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSE...!

*shakes fist at sky*

I love using the DH vs scoots :3

[Omega]

DH speed, RL AoE... vs Scout in an enclosed space? GG

[Omega]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

Well, not for longer ranges, solly wasnt a long range class, but now thats possible with the LL

[Mongoose]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

I'm curious as to how the DH is specific to the speed of a enemy. It works on all just as well as anything else if you can aim.

[Ackybur]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

I'm curious as to how the DH is specific to the speed of a enemy. It works on all just as well as anything else if you can aim.

Rex told me to tell you hi for some reason. He said something about lessons? Idk what he meant..whatever though.

[Techercizer]

I'm curious as to how the DH is specific to the speed of a enemy. It works on all just as well as anything else if you can aim.

Yeah, especially if you use it like a fucking battering ram. *cough cough melee weapon cough cough*

[Argent]

You probably don't need to rename this topic.

[Spyder]

Lol I honestly cannot remember the last time I used the regular old Rocket Launcher.

[Omega]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

I'm curious as to how the DH is specific to the speed of a enemy. It works on all just as well as anything else if you can aim.

The disadvantage of the DH is not the lack of accuracy (if it is, then its just ur own fault ), the disadvantage is its lacking in AoE, its not as effective if ur attacking multiple Targets (I.E. Payload Pushers). The LL takes advantage of the speed increase and makes kritz effective at longer reaches (better to snipe with kritz if its activated rather than for it to be wasted after u kill all nearby enemies ). Also with kritz, the 3 shoot clip size provides enough dmg (if correctly aimed) to eliminate all current hostilities for the wielder to reload his LL. DH is a good weapon (assuming u know how to aim), just lack of AoE (crowd control)

[GoDM1N]

Valve needs to slightly decrease the increase on the LL, so the DH is used more often against slow enemies like it was made to.

umm if anything the DH is for faster enemies, not slower ones.

I'm curious as to how the DH is specific to the speed of a enemy. It works on all just as well as anything else if you can aim.

Oh im not saying its only for one type of enemy or anything. However I'm generally better vs scouts when using it over the normal RL.

[InsaneCanadian]

You probably don't need to rename this topic.

Agreed. Seriously now, what the hell is with the new items. I know that Valve tends to have their little problem with initial weapon balance, but this is insane.

[Omega]

Oh im not saying its only for one type of enemy or anything. However I'm generally better vs scouts when using it over the normal RL.

Yea assuming
A) You can aim with it
B) You can directly hit it for 125 + dmg
C) They arent using the Milkman Set