Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby Rosey » Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:43 pm

Rologton wrote:I mean, I know for me and a lot of the other BLUmins, mixing adminship really wouldn't change anything.


True. I don't really have a big problem with any specific pinkmins myself, but there are general problems. A big annoyance for me is the constant talking and pointless conversation that seems to happen alot over the mics in the funboxes, and I'm all up for fun game modes, just not when everyone's talking your ear off. I haven't been in the funboxes for a while now, so this might not be the case anymore.

"hurr durr theres a mute button for a reason durr"

I'd rather not join then have to use the damn thing every time I do join

Rologton wrote:Nothing against the Funboxes, but I just have no interest in the games played on them, except for maybe Dodgeball on occasion. Even if I had Admin on them, I honestly wouldn't go on any more than I already do, which is to say, almost never.


I for one enjoy the different game modes that appear on the funboxes, it's the general audience it attracts that puts me off. (see above)
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby Beartato » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:43 pm

Not sure how this thread started off, but my two cents:

I could support merging the two, but I would want to see people go through a trial to be a dual-min just to make sure they're acquainted with the other server. In addition to there being different rules in the different servers, there's also different cultures, which are important to pick up on. Rosey mentioned an important one: chatter. Sometimes the chatter pink regulars carry out on the slayboxes becomes annoying for those of us interested in pubbing. Voice is an important communication tool and it isn't fair to take that away from those who want to play the game as a multiplayer FPS. Pinkmin also seem to be less tolerant of binds, which is an issue with the SBs. Bind spam is part of the culture and should be dealt with by asking users to dial it back rather than with gags. I don't mean to rag on the pinkmin, it's just that I only know things from this side; I'm sure someone else can point out mistakes a bluemin would make on the fun servers.

My last concern is popping. When the fun server regulars come to help pop the SBs, they come as a big army and usually get it up to 24 people pretty quickly. But then the 10-12 leave at the end of the popping map, and all of a sudden you have 12-14 players on cp_coldfront or some other less popular map, which is a great way to lose a freshly popped server. It's important that they would take care to avoid that problem if the pinkmin gained power on the SBs and partook in popping duties.

But overall I could support a merge with enough discussion and some experience for those seeking duelmin status. After all, the requirements for adminning the two servers are exactly the same (to my knowledge) so no one is unqualified to help out on the other side of CSn.
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby GoDM1N » Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:43 am

Beartato wrote:Not sure how this thread started off, but my two cents:

I could support merging the two, but I would want to see people go through a trial to be a dual-min just to make sure they're acquainted with the other server. In addition to there being different rules in the different servers, there's also different cultures, which are important to pick up on. Rosey mentioned an important one: chatter. Sometimes the chatter pink regulars carry out on the slayboxes becomes annoying for those of us interested in pubbing. Voice is an important communication tool and it isn't fair to take that away from those who want to play the game as a multiplayer FPS. Pinkmin also seem to be less tolerant of binds, which is an issue with the SBs. Bind spam is part of the culture and should be dealt with by asking users to dial it back rather than with gags. I don't mean to rag on the pinkmin, it's just that I only know things from this side; I'm sure someone else can point out mistakes a bluemin would make on the fun servers.

My last concern is popping. When the fun server regulars come to help pop the SBs, they come as a big army and usually get it up to 24 people pretty quickly. But then the 10-12 leave at the end of the popping map, and all of a sudden you have 12-14 players on cp_coldfront or some other less popular map, which is a great way to lose a freshly popped server. It's important that they would take care to avoid that problem if the pinkmin gained power on the SBs and partook in popping duties.

But overall I could support a merge with enough discussion and some experience for those seeking duelmin status. After all, the requirements for adminning the two servers are exactly the same (to my knowledge) so no one is unqualified to help out on the other side of CSn.

The pink admin rules are here, and as new mods are added they'll change. Also, unless something has changed spamming chat in general isn't allowed, It's not necessarily the binds, it's when the binds take up the whole chat window. Some members, admins as well, rely on that because they don't have a mic, and when people keep it filled with "lol heavies" they cant communicate.
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby Rosey » Thu Oct 10, 2013 9:01 pm

GoDM1N wrote:Also, unless something has changed spamming chat in general isn't allowed, It's not necessarily the binds, it's when the binds take up the whole chat window. Some members, admins as well, rely on that because they don't have a mic, and when people keep it filled with "lol heavies" they cant communicate.


Beartato wrote: Bind spam is part of the culture and should be dealt with by asking users to dial it back rather than with gags. I don't mean to rag on the pinkmin, it's just that I only know things from this side; I'm sure someone else can point out mistakes a bluemin would make on the fun servers.


think deres some miscommunication here buds
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby Arty_pn » Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:16 am

I think spam has to do with timing, end of a round fine, people are moping and celebrating more than team commands then, but during the middle of a round there is near no need to bind spam more than 15 seconds at a time. I've seen a few admins gag after two binds and I feel that is unacceptable if our two words aren't said.
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby check six » Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:03 am

i thought bind spamming died with me. strange.

anyway i dunno, from what i remember funbox culture always had the pretty dumb "randumb" sorta thing that i guess i'd understand why people wouldn't like it, since they share a really, well, childish sort of humor that mor appeals to the "lolrandumb" crowd that generally is more filled with kids idk

but yeah promote mumble, it helped me make some friends in the past even though the only one i talk to anymore is gayboy420 if you're really going for that community thing

ur future plan is 2 unban me rite 8) #meahtsoth >c
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby Balubish » Fri Oct 11, 2013 2:31 am

check six wrote:i thought bind spamming died with me. strange.

ur future plan is 2 unban me rite 8) #meahtsoth >c


Lol, probably ur account died with that spamming and still u want unban in every fuckin thread as we have spoken about haven't we #meatshot? Talk to the redmins about it or the guy that banned ur meatshot ass, about you getting unban. No one else will. The End
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby Beartato » Fri Oct 11, 2013 9:44 am

GoDM1N wrote:The pink admin rules are here, and as new mods are added they'll change. Also, unless something has changed spamming chat in general isn't allowed, It's not necessarily the binds, it's when the binds take up the whole chat window. Some members, admins as well, rely on that because they don't have a mic, and when people keep it filled with "lol heavies" they cant communicate.

It's not as if "these are the rules" clarifies everything. There absolutely is judgment required in enforcing some of those rules and it really comes down to understanding the server you're on. I have a few examples from last night:

  • This is probably a rare one to come up but did happen last night: The use of pallets of crates. Is dropping one of those on the server every 30 seconds spam? After all, the crate drops are going to fill up the chat to a point where chat is hard to use. And some users wanted the pallet users to stop using them. They continued and some people continued complaining, but others were loving it. Would that be harassment of those who didn't want the crates? Can no one use pallets of crates if I single person on the server will object? In the end, I don't think anyone left because of the crates and a lot of people were happy that they got a ton of fall crates or even a salvage crate. Overall, the server remained at 24/24 the entire time and I feel it even helped interest people in our community by seeing that things outside the ordinary happen from time to time.

  • Last night we had a couple people who enjoy talking into the mic. Like, a lot. We're talking "I narrate my life" people. And as a result, pretty much no one else talked because they didn't want to talk with those people. Personally, I think that the narration folk are highly out of place in the SBs while they probably fit right in on the Fun servers. And I say this because one of them from last night is a regular and donor who frequents the Fun servers.

  • Some kid came in last night wanting to mic spam some "files" for us. When I told him it wasn't allowed, he got pretty bent out of shape and went on about the servers are no fun and he got support from the Fun server regular mentioned in my previous point. Well, he went ahead of played his "files" and I got quite a few thanks for kicking the kid from users on the server. (Oddly enough, the kid played the quintessential randumb file: A reading of "katy, teh p3nguin of d00m." Like saber mentioned, randumb isn't exactly appreciated in the SBs.)

  • And then binds. Those are actually received well on the SBs. Generally people call-and-response with them. One person uses one and five people will use theirs. They're a lot better received than narrating your life over the mic, for sure. But I've noticed in the past that duelmins who spend more time on the Fun servers are quick to gag for their use and without any warning. If nothing else, it's the heavy handedness of gagging without warning that is unnecessary.

So yeah, it's all about judgment because "Don't be a douchebag" isn't a black-and-white rule. The cultures of the different servers require different viewpoints for managing them. In my experience and opinion, it's not helpful to plop a pinkmin into the SBs and give them full powers. That's why I advocate a trial "culture immersion" period for people wishing to work on both sets of servers.
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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby UncleTestes » Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:13 am

I'll add my part since I still want to be an admin.

As for merging, I'm alright with it but, excluding popping duties, would there be a requirement to carry out administration duties on both servers equally, or near equally?

As for bind spam, I was hoping it had died with the wide-eyed smiley face spam (though entertaining at first, was horribly overused). As for Crate pallets, I think a warning should be in order, especially if there's another conversation going on. (except we don't have a good way of informing people of that rule to new players, or strangers who join servers and immediately use the things) However I've seen several people get Salvaged Crates from these, and as Beartato said they cause more joy than anger, so I don't think we should ban them indefinitely.

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Re: Future of CSN: A Grand Misguided Plan -Miopic discussion

Postby GoDM1N » Fri Oct 11, 2013 10:40 am

Beartato wrote:
GoDM1N wrote:The pink admin rules are here, and as new mods are added they'll change. Also, unless something has changed spamming chat in general isn't allowed, It's not necessarily the binds, it's when the binds take up the whole chat window. Some members, admins as well, rely on that because they don't have a mic, and when people keep it filled with "lol heavies" they cant communicate.

It's not as if "these are the rules" clarifies everything. There absolutely is judgment required in enforcing some of those rules and it really comes down to understanding the server you're on. I have a few examples from last night:

  • This is probably a rare one to come up but did happen last night: The use of pallets of crates. Is dropping one of those on the server every 30 seconds spam? After all, the crate drops are going to fill up the chat to a point where chat is hard to use. And some users wanted the pallet users to stop using them. They continued and some people continued complaining, but others were loving it. Would that be harassment of those who didn't want the crates? Can no one use pallets of crates if I single person on the server will object? In the end, I don't think anyone left because of the crates and a lot of people were happy that they got a ton of fall crates or even a salvage crate. Overall, the server remained at 24/24 the entire time and I feel it even helped interest people in our community by seeing that things outside the ordinary happen from time to time.

  • Last night we had a couple people who enjoy talking into the mic. Like, a lot. We're talking "I narrate my life" people. And as a result, pretty much no one else talked because they didn't want to talk with those people. Personally, I think that the narration folk are highly out of place in the SBs while they probably fit right in on the Fun servers. And I say this because one of them from last night is a regular and donor who frequents the Fun servers.

  • Some kid came in last night wanting to mic spam some "files" for us. When I told him it wasn't allowed, he got pretty bent out of shape and went on about the servers are no fun and he got support from the Fun server regular mentioned in my previous point. Well, he went ahead of played his "files" and I got quite a few thanks for kicking the kid from users on the server. (Oddly enough, the kid played the quintessential randumb file: A reading of "katy, teh p3nguin of d00m." Like saber mentioned, randumb isn't exactly appreciated in the SBs.)

  • And then binds. Those are actually received well on the SBs. Generally people call-and-response with them. One person uses one and five people will use theirs. They're a lot better received than narrating your life over the mic, for sure. But I've noticed in the past that duelmins who spend more time on the Fun servers are quick to gag for their use and without any warning. If nothing else, it's the heavy handedness of gagging without warning that is unnecessary.

So yeah, it's all about judgment because "Don't be a douchebag" isn't a black-and-white rule. The cultures of the different servers require different viewpoints for managing them. In my experience and opinion, it's not helpful to plop a pinkmin into the SBs and give them full powers. That's why I advocate a trial "culture immersion" period for people wishing to work on both sets of servers.

This pretty much sums up why I think mixing the two is a bad idea. The only thing I'd say is if someone is hogging the mic like that, do a vote mute. I think non admins can start these as well. That way the players make the judgment call for you
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